anyone had eye surgery? INTACS intercorneal rings

roid · Post by **roid** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:06 pm

it's kinda cool and fitting, that i often get introduced to cutting edge technologies through my work at ZZZonline. i remember doing an article on CSIRO's long wear (gas permiable) disposable contact lense technology, and then i promptly asked my optometrist about it and got myself some (which i still use).

and more recently, among the implantable eye robots and eye squeezing wireless belts (yes i'm serious on both accounts), there was a tech called INTACS. what the tech was was a ring of a certain precription thickness that is inserted into the cornea, it's mere presense changing the shape of the cornea surface. basically it's a superior alternative to LASIK surgery, because while it is permanent, it's also entirely reversable by simply removing the ring.
a doc can also remove the ring and put in a different new one if your precription changes.

so i've been recently looking into this INTACS thing, looking to get it done on my eyes. contact lenses are good and all, but i don't wear them much because even though they are long wear ones (put them in, then never take them out - noteven at night - until one month later) they still dry out. they dry out especially when watching a movie or using a pc.

i'd like to know of your expereinces with eye surgery, and i'd ESPECIALLY like to know what your thoughts are about INTACS, and if you have had it "installed" into your eyes.

Sage · Post by **Sage** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 1:21 am

I wear glasses, but they are a REAL pain in the as. This new ring sh8t sounds mighty fine.

Avder · Post by **Avder** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 1:28 am

Yeah, that ring looks like something I wanna get for my eyes. Im sick of wearing glasses. Just once when I wake up in the morning I'd like to be able to read my alarm clock without squinting or leaning way out of bed.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 3:30 am

wow .. that's a pretty cool idea. Much better than the laser surgery if it works. It will be intersting to see what complications, if any, will occur.

Eye surgery like this might not be too bad. About 2 to 3 weeks of drops, but that should be it. My wife has had oh ... 4 or 5 eye surgerys. They were a bit more involved than this. Retnal reattachments etc ....

This sounds really cool. Might look into that for myself. Where is this originating at? There in Australia or the states? If there.. it will be several years before it's approved. If here.. then it's been going thru the red tape for a while now i would think.

roid · Post by **roid** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 5:46 am

it's already approved and being routinely done in australia and usa (among a bajillion other countrys) right now. it originated in the states, some years ago.
so if you are interested then you shoudl probably ask your doc, optometrist, or ring up an eye surgery (you know, the places that do the LASIK laser eye stuff), you'll probably be able to get it done if you want it. that's what i'm doing afterall.

it's known to give results better than 20/20 vision, which among other reasons is why the australian defence forces seem to be really into it (according to my research).

google, or i can save you some time:
check out http://www.getintacs.com/

i personally found these segments of a (frame based) victorian laser eye surgery place to be good.
http://www.vistalasereye.com.au/text13.html and http://www.vistalasereye.com.au/adf.html
coz at the time i was looking to see if anyone in australia did it. according to this, that's an affirmative

.
(so i'm gonna look around local eye surgerys to see who does it, also i'll be finding out a price, and i'll need to ask my private health insurer about it.)

(also my initial introduction to the tech, zzzonline issue 195, just near the bottom)

Lobber · Post by **Lobber** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 8:33 am

I'm glad that even though I am slightly far sighted, and have a slight stigmatism in my right eye, I can see perfectly fine. I do have headaches more often though, forcing my eyes to focus when they should be relaxing.

Tricord · Post by **Tricord** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 8:44 am

I wear comfortable glasses (titanium lightweight and flexible with double-thinned plexiglass), so they don't bother me at all.

However, two years ago I looked into contacts (literally

) and got a test pair. Aside from the endless eye poking and fiddling to get them in, they weren't very nice to wear. I had like a slightly double vision with them, so I never bothered.
I should have gone back and ask for other types of contacts or whatever. Might look into that again.

Thing is, in some lighting my glasses project horrible shadows around my nose

Instig8 · Post by **Instig8** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 5:17 pm

I'll stick with my glasses and contacts. Eye surgery has a small margin for error.

With these rings, they say it can be undone by removing the rings. Is that true? Can you also undo the scarring? Although, the rings certainly appear less risky than PRK, lasik, etc.

For an elective operation, it poses too great a risk for me.

Check out: http://www.surgicaleyes.org/ It has lots of information. (Not to scare y'all or anything.)

Sage · Post by **Sage** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 6:09 pm

Yeh, I guess glasses wouldn't be bad if you get a good pair. Mine are just really REALLY bad.

How much does this stuff cost?

roid · Post by **roid** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 9:24 pm

i just got a reply back:

Thank you for your enquiry regarding vision correction with Vista. The
cost of the INTACS procedure is $2450(AU) per eye which is inclusive of your
pre-operative visits, the procedure, the drops/medications required
afterwards and your post-operative care for 12 months. At the moment
private health funds do not cover it as they class it as being an
elective procedure.

urg, that's pretty exensive, especially if i have to shell out for ALL OF IT from my own pocket. i would expect other surgerys to be a similar price, but that won't stop me from checking around still.

for both eyes, that works out to $3613-USD, or $4900-AU.

how much would you guys spend on glasses or contact lenses, average every year?

Sage · Post by **Sage** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 9:39 pm

EHHHH, we can get a pair of glasses for free once every year for free w/ my dad's insurance from work...

Tetrad · Post by **Tetrad** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 11:21 pm

I usually spend around $300/pair every 2-3 years or so. I'm blind as a bat without my glasses so that's not to be completely unexpected.

If I could get rid of them in a safe/reversible way without any "OMG YOU'RE DRILLING INTO MY EYE" stuff going on, I'd consider doing so, but until then I'm sticking with the glasses.

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 6:24 am

[MS]Instig8 wrote: With these rings, they say it can be undone by removing the rings. Is that true? Can you also undo the scarring? Although, the rings certainly appear less risky than PRK, lasik, etc.

Actually the eye surface is the only part of our body that does not scar.

Warlock · Post by **Warlock** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:21 am

im sticking with my glasses cause im so use to them

DCrazy · Post by **DCrazy** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:39 am

But the cornea and retina do scar... that's what you have to be afraid of.

roid · Post by **roid** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:51 am

but is not the cornea the layered surface of the eye?

you may be meaning the iris dc.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 1:23 pm

Nice idea -- unfortunately:

"Intacs prescription inserts are FDA-approved for people whose prescription for eyeglasses or contact lenses is between -1.00 and -3.00 diopters, with no more than 1.00 diopter of astigmatism."

Would barely work on my left eye (-1.75 -1.00/20Â°) but not on my right (-5.75 -0.50/175Â°) ..

Since my eyes are fragile and I only have this set I'll stay away from LASIK os. stuff. Glasses work but I miss wearing shades -- new contacts for next year it is.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 1:58 pm

I've had my pair of glasses (for distance viewing/driving only) for about two years, I'd guess, and I can't complain. I'm never touching contacts, out of an irrational phobia toward putting something in my eye (I can't even stand eyedrops

). Lasik? Not unless I'm planning to be an astronaut (who knows?

) These implants look like a good alternative to laser surgery; they're easily reversible and much simpler.

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 2:37 pm

I can't imagine how this would be 'superior' to LASIK as you claim. The benefits of LASIK for people in our age range, depending on your eye condition, most likely will lead to not have anything major done with your eyes until you're approaching your 50s.

I would imagine that these do about the same as the degradation in eyesight becomes more drastic later in life. LASIK is a much more worthwhile choice for people in their twenties. Something like this might actually be more worthwhile when your eyesight after LASIK starts to deteriorate due to aging when LASIK surgery becomes less effective.

It is kind of a neat idea though, embedded contact lenses in a sense. Pretty cool.

roid · Post by **roid** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 11:25 pm

how is LASIK better?

Tyranny wrote:LASIK is a much more worthwhile choice for people in their twenties.

but, why? INTACS are superior in every way.

for LASIK surgury the surgeon peals away a flap of your cornea, burns away some of the inner cornea with a laser, then puts the removed flap back on.

with INTACS the surgeon makes an insision, and inserts the semi-rings into the cornea, inbetween the fibrous corneal tissues, which holds them tight (these fibres form the layers, that allows the cornea to be pealed off in seperate layers for LASIK surgery). no tissue is removed at all, and nothing is done to the central sight. it needs no lasers, it's entirely reversable. it has the opportunity for a lot less complications than LASIK does, the eye does not have to heal a large laser-damaged surface.

with LASIK your eye is damaged and has to really heal, a lot. among possible complications are a haze across your vision from the laser abrasions (i'm not sure why they call it "abrasion"), with INTACS the rings are not even in your central sight, you can't see them.

during LASIK surgery: tissue is removed, it never grows back. ★■◆● something up during LASIK (remove too much tissue, or get that haze thing) and what are you gonna do? you can't undo it.
also LASIK doesn't create the same constant quality of spherical bend across the eye as INTACS do, since INTACS just bend the eye surface. where as LASIK burns it away manually.

Mr. Perfect · Post by **Mr. Perfect** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:40 am

My nearly-90 grandmother had these put in about two years ago. She still uses reading glasses, but for everything else the intacs is all she uses.

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:53 am

You make it sound as if people are blind for a couple days after LASIK roid. The people I've talked with who have had it done noticed improvements in sight quality within just a few hours or shorter after the surgery. Besides, it is a walk in walk out surgery. Nothing so major that you would have to stay overnight anyways. It isn't like they're removing your eyes or something.

Personally I'd rather have my eyes fixed without having anything put into them to correct it. LASIK provides no foreign objects implanted into your eyes to see. LASIK merely corrects your eyes without having to put something on them or in them.

Either method really depends on the severity of your eyesight anyways. These INTACS sound great for a last resort.

roid · Post by **roid** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:18 pm

INTACS surgery is also walk in walk out, just as LASIK. but the improvements are instantaneous (:P).

but yeah i understand the foriegn objects thing.
it should be said though, that it's the same stuff they use to make the lenses for cataract patients. it causes no problems.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:03 pm

I inherited quite a bad set of eyes so I'm very "eye consious". I wouldn't do LASIK because it's very invasive and all kind of things can go wrong (and will go wrong w/ my luck

) but would be fine w/ INTACS since it's a reversable procedure.. Unfortunately it won't work for me (as stated above).

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:31 am

You know they do make prescription glasses that also work as sunglasses. You can either get the kind like mine where they snap on using strong magnets on the corners (very nice, not tacky like those clipons that you can buy that go on the nose piece, blegh) or you can get the kind like my sister uses where they automatically become sunglasses when exposed to outside sunlight.

Thats one of the things I hated is that I couldn't wear shades while I was driving because of these stupid things. Then I finally went in to get my eyes checked again and got a new pair of glasses that also came with shades.

If you go and take the time and make sure you get the right doctor to perform the LASIK you should be fine. You don't need to settle for these little shady thrift mall eye surgeons who will do the work for cheap everytime you need to get something done

roid · Post by **roid** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:45 am

when we get tattoos, i'll take mine under the skin, while you can get yours permantently burned onto the surface.

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:55 am

heh...ooook.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Thu Oct 14, 2004 9:22 pm

I dont need eye stuff... for now... but my mom, she has perscription sunglasses... she can see perfectly fine through them, but they were like 500$

roid · Post by **roid** » Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:03 pm

yeah i have prescription sunnies, that i prefer to wear rather than my normal glasses. but it'd be nice to be rid of all of em (and just use normal sunnies if i so choose).

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:04 pm

why doesnt laser eye surgury work too well?

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 6:50 pm

It does, it just depends on who does the work and how bad your eyes are. That and some people, like roid apparently, are afraid of it

Whats the harm in 'potentially' going blind? It might give you some perspective